Join Host Chad Prinkey (Well Built Construction) and Co-host, Stacey Holsinger, (Steel Toe Communications) every Tuesday morning at 8 a.m. EST. on LinkedIn as they interview top A/E/C industry experts. Guests can participate in the conversation live!

Transcript:

So we're two days before Thanksgiving for the morning huddle. And, you know, it gets to be this time of year, and, you know, it's. At least for me, today and tomorrow is cram everything in before Thanksgiving. What's today and tomorrow look like for you guys? 

S

Speaker 2

00:26

Pretty busy for me. This is actually usually my favorite week of the year. Wednesday is like a half day kind of feel. But not this year. It's gonna be. 

S

Speaker 3

00:38

Yeah, not for me either, unfortunately. Me and Josh just realized we're both headed to Philadelphia to visit family in Bucks County. This is the first year that me and my brothers are taking over Thanksgiving and cooking for my mom. So my mom gets to relax, but we're using her house still. So is. 

S

Speaker 1

01:00

Do you think your mom will actually relax? Because I know if. Like, that sounds like a really cool theory for my mom, there's zero chance she would relax. 

S

Speaker 3

01:07

Exactly. I'm sure she's. You know, she says that she's going to be busy with my son, but I know she'll be popping in the kitchen checking. 

S

Speaker 2

01:16

And for the record, I said I was excited to go see my family. Stacy, I didn't say that. 

S

Speaker 3

01:23

Butts. 

S

Speaker 2

01:25

It was. 

S

Speaker 1

01:25

She just didn't. She didn't say. 

S

Speaker 2

01:27

I didn't hear it. I didn't hear it. 

S

Speaker 1

01:28

That's all. 

S

Speaker 3

01:30

Well, I have heavy responsibilities this year, so. 

S

Speaker 2

01:34

So. 

S

Speaker 1

01:34

So I got. I. I started on total accident. I started a little bit of family drama yesterday. We've got, of course, the obligatory family text thread, and I saw this article on how to prepare, like, the best Thanksgiving turkey, and I was like, oh, I'll send this along. And of course, it was like, my mother was like, sure, we can change the way that I do Thanksgiving turkey. Evidently, that's not good enough for you. And I'm like, no, I'm. So there was no agenda? No agenda. 

S

Speaker 2

01:59

It was awesome. 

S

Speaker 1

02:01

All right, let's go ahead and get rolling. For Tuesday, November 23, 2021. Welcome to the morning huddle. I'm Chad Prinky alongside my partner and producer, Stacy Holzinger. Stacy, how are you today? 

S

Speaker 3

02:20

Good. Great. 

S

Speaker 1

02:22

What? 

S

Speaker 2

02:23

So. 

S

Speaker 1

02:23

So going. Going to Bucks County. Is that, like, the standard? You always go to mom's? 

S

Speaker 3

02:28

Yeah. She would not give up her holiday for anything. For. I mean, she's an excellent cook, so I don't think anybody really wanted her to give it up. But this year, she's like, I'm taking a break. You guys got the kitchen. 

S

Speaker 1

02:41

So, you know, it. It's. It's. My best recommendation is to screw it up that way next year you get to return back to traditional. 

S

Speaker 3

02:49

That's a good idea. 

S

Speaker 1

02:51

That's my. That's what I do with the dishes when I'm given that task, you know, Anyway, so. All right, cool. So, Stacy, you know, Stacy's role, as always, is to come in that last 10 minutes and capture all of the awesome questions that come in throughout the course of the session. So for those of you who are viewing live right now on LinkedIn Live, please make sure that you get comfortable with that chat function. Fire your questions across. We want a chance to address those throughout the course of the session today. So, Stacy, we'll see you with 10 minutes to go. Thank you so much. I know you'll come locked and loaded with some good ones. See you soon. 

S

Speaker 3

03:33

See ya. 

S

Speaker 1

03:34

So today my guest is Josh Hauserman. Josh. Josh is a good friend of mine personally, but he is the head of the bonding group for HMS Insurance Associates, where he leads a team of 11 agents and three other support staff that help to make those agents successful. And Josh is also always behind the scenes to help not only his own clients, but the teams, the rest of his team's clients, to solve complex business and construction problems, you know, to help these contractor clients to get things done. I actually knew Josh before I ever met Josh through my clients, who anytime in a conversation over the years, you know, I've been serving the construction industry for 12, 13 years. 

S

Speaker 1

04:23

Over that time frame, I would get into conversations with contractors and talk about their most trusted advisors, you know, their lawyers, their accountants, things like that. And I would hear Josh's name a lot. So we shared a lot of overlap with our account base. And eventually I just thought, I gotta meet this guy. People talk about him. My clients speak about him the way I hope they speak to others about me. And so Josh and I got to know each other. He and I share so many views about the building industry. He's taught me a lot personally so that I've been able to better serve my clients as an advisor. So when I invited Josh to join, I was really excited that he accepted. We're here to talk business, and today's topic is Common Threads. 

S

Speaker 1

05:07

The most bondable contractors, from the view of someone whose team writes somewhere around $8 billion in bonds a year. So, Josh, before we get rolling, give us any additional intro on yourself to give some context. Who are you beyond what I've laid out for our audience. 

S

Speaker 2

05:28

Yeah, you nailed it. First of all, thanks for having me. And also thanks for hosting our client seminar last week. For additional background, I've been here for close to 17 years now. I started out just handling house account leads and basically supporting our producers. I was in that role for about five years and gave me a great deal of experience. I have my master's degree in accounting, which helps a great deal, as you can imagine, in this field, and ever since then been off and running. 

S

Speaker 1

06:03

Awesome. 

S

Speaker 2

06:04

So. 

S

Speaker 1

06:04

So I don't want to take for granted. There are going to be some people who are watching this morning or listening, you know, on the recording that are construction and bonding gurus. They know what they're talking about. Right. They've got years and years of experience in the industry. There are other. Also going to be some people who are kind of get the concept of bonding, but they don't. You know, they're not, they're certainly not experts. Could you give us like the 1 minute overview of what is bonding just to kind of give context to the remainder of our conversation today? 

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Speaker 2

06:39

Yes. So I'll answer it as it relates to the construction industry specifically, but basically it's a credit transaction to give you like the Bond 101 answer. It's the underwriting is based on character capacity and capital. Character, meaning you're going to do what you say you're going to do. And you know, your references will check out, you haven't had a bankruptcy. Things like that. Capacity, meaning you have the labor, the equipment, the experience to handle the jobs in your backlog. And capital, meaning you have money. 

S

Speaker 1

07:14

Got it. And so a bond might be defined. 

S

Speaker 2

07:19

As what I would say. A bond in this context is synonymous with a guarantee. So you have a bid bond, which is a guarantee for your bid performance. Bond guarantees your performance of the contract. And a payment bond guarantees payment of subcontractors and suppliers. 

S

Speaker 1

07:36

Excellent. All right, cool. So with that as the backdrop, it's this, you know, question of credit worthiness. You know, that's going on. Capacity, character, capacity. And what's the last one? 

S

Speaker 2

07:50

Capital. 

S

Speaker 1

07:51

Capital. Character capacity and capital. Okay, good. 

S

Speaker 2

07:53

All right. 

S

Speaker 1

07:53

That's a good backdrop. So I think most. What bonding means to me. I think most contractors want to be able to brag about their bonding capacity. Most, most contractors, my impression is it's a way of sort of humbly communicating their financial stability, strength, trustworthiness, etc. As a bonding pro, what do you think high bonding capacities really signify when somebody says, you know, we've got X, you know, desirable bonding capacity? 

S

Speaker 2

08:28

Yes. First I would agree with you. I think it's a status symbol within the construction community. And really what it represents is staying power. And I would argue that the underwriting process is effectively a construction best practices checklist. You kind of, you get into a contractor's operation and you see, you know, look under the hood and see how they perform and, you know, all the upside, the downside, and everything else. 

S

Speaker 1

09:01

You mentioned best practices. Best practices in what way? What are some of the examples of best practices or the checklist? So if I were, if I'm a contractor, this is valuable information because there's a. There's clearly a list of, you know, are you doing things right that, you know, that underwriters are using? What are some of the things that are included in that kind of best practices? 

S

Speaker 2

09:28

Yeah, I mean, I would say it's in a word or two words, operational excellence. And that's in every department and throughout the organization. So that starts with, you knowing your costs and having a accurate accounting system, bidding, you know, having checks and balances in your bid process, obviously having the experience in the field, having the labor to support the projects that you're bidding. Good subcontractor relationships, whether you're a GC or a subcontractor, identifying risks on projects. And I think the biggest thing is you can tell in a conversation with a contractor if, when you bring up, you know, potential pitfalls or things that could drive a project to go sideways, if that contractor has a backup plan for their backup plans, I think that's the best way to put it. 

S

Speaker 2

10:21

So in other words, if, you know, I've been in meetings where there's concern about labor and, you know, we have a great crew here, but what if the next contractor over comes over and offers, you know, field labor $2 more an hour and, you know, they disappear one day, what do you do? So you have to think about scenarios like that. You know, how are you going to manage your subcontractors on the critical path? Yeah, just, you know, evaluating contract terms. You have to have controls in place and really just vetting not only project risk, but operational risk within your organization. 

S

Speaker 1

10:58

Interesting. I'll tell you one thing that I want to zoom in on is this idea as I listened to your checklist. Okay. Things went from in my mind, kind of, you know, basic to more and more complex as you kind of went down the line. So I'm, you know, just going through, like, knowing your costs. Gosh, I, I betcha that there's a substantial number of contractors that can't Check that box, you know, fully. So when somebody. And then there's, and then there's maybe the contingency plan for the contingency plan being that one's, you know, sort of really advanced. So if you've got knowing your costs as a foundational item, then there's contingency plans for contingency plans as something that is, you know, do you think about this at all in any kind of hierarchy? 

S

Speaker 1

12:00

Is that something that you know, look at or is that just my interpretation? 

S

Speaker 2

12:05

You know, I wouldn't necessarily look at it in that way. I would look at it more along the lines of you're only as strong as your weakest link. So if you think about it, if you, if there's 20 boxes to check and you check 19 of them, that one unchecked box could be the shortfall that takes a company under. So I, in my opinion, I think it's, you know, you try to have as much depth as possible in each line item. 

S

Speaker 1

12:32

Got it. So what. One of the things that I know, certainly most contractors spend a lot of time thinking about, and rightfully so, for lots of business reasons and personal reasons, is profitability. But what role does profitability play? Is it just one of the checkboxes? What role does profitability play in a company's bonding capacity? 

S

Speaker 2

13:02

It's huge, but it depends on the metric. So, for instance, I'm going to dig in deep and then I'll walk it back a little bit. But obviously profitability is paramount in the bond underwriting process because ultimately profitability enables a contractor to build their balance sheet. And once you have the working capital and equity, basically that effectively means that you do have staying power, and that's what getting bonded is ultimately all about. The caveat to that is you want to best practices relative to profitability. Except I'd argue one item that is counter to bond underwriting as it relates to profitability, and that's the return on investment metric. 

S

Speaker 2

13:50

Because basically you can drive that metric higher with a leaner balance sheet, which is counter, like I said, it's counter to bond underwriting where, you know, it's bond underrated based on balance sheet metrics and having the wherewithal to, you know, whether a bad job or, you know, weather downturns in the economy. And obviously all that starts with profitability. But that's one carve out that I'd say is ROI isn't necessarily a metric. But to answer your question, yeah, profitability is paramount. 

S

Speaker 1

14:28

At the risk of Going into real bonding. Geek land. Talk more about the ROI metric. 

S

Speaker 2

14:37

So we actually. Yeah, we wouldn't. Right. It's. So return on investment is basically net income relative to your equity or, you know, starting capital in the company. From my perspective, that's not, you know, it's cat. I say it's counter to our underwriting metrics because if you came to me and said you were going to start a construction business and you gave me two scenarios, one where you were going to put in a million dollars to start and another scenario where you're going to put in $2 million to start, I would probably recommend the 2 million, obviously depending on what you wanted to do. But that makes that checks that staying power box in a more effective manner, if that makes sense. 

S

Speaker 1

15:19

It does. So what are. Let me ask this question. I'm interested in what we can learn from the companies who consistently look the best in the eyes of underwriters. So for this audience that mostly consists of contractors and also people who, you know, deal with contractors on a daily basis, what can we learn from the companies who consistently are viewed as good risks in the eyes of underwriters? 

S

Speaker 2

15:55

I would go back to the, you know, the best practices approach. I think one of the very important things, and obviously this depends on where a contractor is in their life cycle and if it's a, you know, long standing contractor that has a, you know, long history of profitability, it's going to be a different scenario. And they might not need the level of advice. However, I mean, it comes back to operational excellence in every department. Right. So with your estimate going back to knowing your costs, I think that's imperative because you're making management decisions based on your performance. You're not going to know your performance unless you have accurate cost controls. You're not going to be able to bid accurately if you don't know all of your costs and know them accurately. 

S

Speaker 2

16:43

You're not going to know which customers to focus on or which scopes of work to focus on if you don't have those true cost figures. So I'd start there and then, you know, if you think about contingency planning, you know, having a stable subcontractors and suppliers having, you know, plan A, plan B, plan C, that also goes for capital as well. Right. Best practices would tell you to tell contractors to establish a working capital line of credit, but not necessarily use it and keep it for a rainy day. And that way if a project does go sideways or if there's a hiccup along the way, you know, you have an outlet. 

S

Speaker 1

17:22

I want to get back to this cost controls thing for a second, Josh, is that, you know, really practically, if I were a contractor and said I'm looking at myself in the mirror and I really don't have a handle fully on my costs, I get to the end of the project and I'm kind of holding my breath, and that's where I peek and see, like, did we do okay? You know, and some of them, it's even tougher, right? They get to the end of the year and they just, it's really like what's left, you know, if I'm in that boat, what are some tangible recommendations that you would have for getting my hands wrapped around my costs? Like, just what are some things that you've seen your clients do that give them better control? 

S

Speaker 2

18:05

That's a good question. Again, that would depend on the size of the contractor. But I think the easy answer is leverage technology. You know, whether it's having a project management system tied to your accounting system that ties to your bidding system and have everything integrated. From my perspective, I think doing a postmortem analysis is imperative. Right? That's how you know how your project teams are performing, how your customers, how valuable your customers are to you know, and types of work. So I would say leveraging technology. And the second thing is lean on trusted industry professionals. And in that world, it's obviously your construction oriented cpa. I think that's imperative. I think a lot of the time you'll, you can ask most CPAs if they specialize in construction. I would say most might say yes. 

S

Speaker 2

19:02

My recommendation is look at companies that you admire and companies, other contractors that, you know, you strive to be like them, and look at the industry professionals that they work with and, you know, start there for your cpa, for your attorney, for your, you know, construction consultant, bond agent, insurance agent. The whole night. 

S

Speaker 1

19:23

Makes total sense. Yep, I, I agree. I think, I think the answer, you know, said in maybe a different way is also don't. Don't try to go it alone. There's technology and there are professionals that are literally there to help you to get your hands wrapped around that stuff. And there's absolutely nothing that should stop you from reaching out to those folks. Just a quick reminder to our audience, please start firing in some questions from your perspective so that we can shift gears to that in just a few minutes while I move on to another question. So, yeah, what are the most common mistakes that you see contractors make that are most damaging to their bondability. 

S

Speaker 2

20:10

Good question. The short answer is losing money. But the situations that I've seen lead to losing money. It's any combination of trying to grow too fast, owner disengagement, lack of internal controls. A big one that I've seen is obviously jobs can go sideways. The construction industry is very dynamic. But if you see that there's a systemic problem and there's systemic risk, either on the, you know, specific scope of work that you're pursuing or a specific customer or type of contract, if you see a systemic risk and you do not address it's going to come back to haunt you. So I've seen that quite a bit. Yeah. And then just not, I guess the attitude, not having the attitude of I don't know what, I don't know. 

S

Speaker 2

21:05

I think obviously you need to be confident, but, you know, you have to have that little devil's advocate in your ear from time to time. 

S

Speaker 1

21:14

To me, it goes down to what I'm, how I'm translating what you're saying is. It goes down to, you know, working on your business. So when it comes to working on your bonding capacity, what you're not working on your bonding capacity, you're working on your business. Yeah. That's what you're really doing. And, and so if a part of what you want is to improve your bondability, which will enable more growth, which will enable more opportunity and profitability and all those different types of things, if that's what you're looking for you can't accept your things as they are today and say, yeah, this is just, it's what I know, it's what you know, this isn't what I do. I'm not going to be great at these things. 

S

Speaker 1

22:05

You know, one of the biggest problems or, you know, kind of, I don't know, nails on a chalkboard. For me when I hear is that like we don't, we don't want to overdue process. We don't. We just really don't. Like, we like, you know, kind of allowing our people freedom. 

S

Speaker 2

22:18

Right. 

S

Speaker 1

22:18

Which is to me, it's all. I'm not opposed to either of those comments, but usually when I look under the hood, what that is code for is like we like to wing everything. And, and that is a really good indicator of somebody that is. It's going to be really difficult if you have that mindset to actually work on improving, to actually improve your business because you're just Resisting adopting best practices and principles. So, all right, I want to open up the door for the questions that are coming in and toss the ball here to Stacy, who I'm going to bring back. Stacy, what do we got? What kind of questions do we have for Josh? 

S

Speaker 3

23:10

Sure. So what advice would you give a contractor looking to grow their bonding capacity? 

S

Speaker 2

23:18

The. And this actually ties into Chad's last question too. But focus on the bottom line. Don't chase revenue, don't chase the top line. Focus on the bottom line. Retain profits, establishment controls and systems. Lean on your trusted advisors. You know, you're just like we had mentioned, CPA, attorney, construction consultant, you know, bond agent, insurance agent, the whole nine, obviously leveraging technology. And I think the biggest thing frankly for me in life is just having a growth mindset and always trying to learn. You never want to be in a position to have the industry pass you by. And if you think about what it takes to maximize your bonding capacity and the goal of bonding companies in establishing a bond program with a contractor, it's staying power. 

S

Speaker 2

24:12

And I haven't talked to any contractors who tell me the five year plan and that includes going bankrupt in year five. Right. So the goals are aligned in that regard. The friction usually comes with the amount of capital that's required to retain in the company to substantiate a larger bond program. So I think that's the key. Profitability and retaining earnings and then growing from there. 

S

Speaker 1

24:34

So I have a follow on question regarding profitability. I totally agree with you that companies put way too much emphasis on top line growth and not nearly enough emphasis on what that ultimately means to profitability. But is there such a thing as too much focus on profitability? In other words, here, how about this? Are there costs that you wouldn't recommend cutting? You know what I mean? You're sort of saying don't do that, don't cut. 

S

Speaker 2

25:12

So yeah, it's a good question. So you don't want to step over dollars to reach for pennies. Right. You don't want to try to maximize your profitability this year and sacrifice your profitability the following three years as a result. So obviously, you know, it's a balance. So when I say retain earnings and focus on profitability, that still requires leaning on your trusted advisors and industry professionals. Obviously there's a cost that comes with that. Leveraging technology, there's a cost that comes with that, but that's not, those are investments in my opinion. So I think differentiate between investing in the future, investing in your company. That's obviously imperative as it relates to staying power. But if you're looking to cut costs, do you need to go to an industry event across the country and stay an extra week, something like that? 

S

Speaker 2

26:07

That's obviously not necessarily an investment in your company. So, yeah, to answer your question, I'm not saying cut all costs and pinch every penny. It's, it's, you know, invest in your company and keep an eye on the long term. 

S

Speaker 1

26:19

And do underwriters get that? So if I'm able to, to show the underwriter, if I'm able to sort of say like, okay, yes, we did not improve our bottom line last year. We did 3% in 2020. We're doing it. We're going to do 3% again in bottom line in 2021. But I want you to see here this, you know, $140,000 worth of investments that we've made that I could have let go to the bottom line, but that we actually put into this training program that we put into, you know, employee raises so that we, you know, became more durable against, you know, rising incomes. And we didn't want to lose our key people to write. Do underwriters get that? Do they, you know, can you, do you get an opportunity to tell that story? 

S

Speaker 2

27:06

Yeah, I mean, quite simply, that's our job as a bond professional and bond agent. Right. So a story like that doesn't necessarily jump off the page and, you know, it's not like it's highlighted in the financials. 

S

Speaker 1

27:19

Right. 

S

Speaker 2

27:20

But our job is to provide context around those financials. That's an easy story to tell. If a company's still profitable and making investments into the future. If it's a situation where, you know, like everything else, it's a balance. So if there's a scenario where, you know, you have a contractor who's lost money three years in a row and it's the same narrative all three years, like, it's not going to fly. So there's a balance there. But the short answer is absolutely, that's part of the story. And obviously it's an investment in the future. And, and obviously that matters. And that's ultimately what bonding companies want, is staying power and a long term view on things. 

S

Speaker 1

27:55

Awesome. 

S

Speaker 2

27:55

All right, Stacey, what else? 

S

Speaker 3

27:57

Yeah, so Blake Radcliffe asked, with so many projects running over schedule and over budget, plus rising labor challenges, how are you calculating and managing risk? 

S

Speaker 2

28:10

So I wouldn't say there's a set metric relative to that type of risk. It's, you know, let's have a conversation about how you're going to address it. So when I mentioned previously, you know, you have your plan A and your plan B and your plan C, that doesn't necessarily mean that plans B and C are still, you know, makes the. The job, whatever, you know, like a very successful job for you. But if it's something that keeps it from being a total disaster, that helps. So I think the biggest thing is just having contingency plans. So in other words, you know, with all the supply chain issues now, are you able to substitute products? Are you able to obtain supply bonds from suppliers, which, you know, in my world, it's. It's always mentioned, but I know in practice, it's. 

S

Speaker 2

28:58

It's more challenging than it, you know, than it would otherwise appear. But just things like that and having. Having access. If you're a subcontractor, having access to not only the gc, but the owner to have those conversations of, you know, contingency plans relative to specified materials, things like that, and relative to labor. You know, if you can't staff a job, maybe not bid it. If, if you have the labor at the date and it evaporates by the time the project starts, then maybe plan B is subbing it out and you're obviously sacrificing margin. But at least, like I said, it'll keep you from. It'll avoid a large problem and maybe keep it a small problem. 

S

Speaker 1

29:45

Yeah, I think that's a great point. So it's all about making sure that you have given consideration to what would be necessary if I still had to perform, how would I work through these things? What are alternate materials? What are alternate labor sources, what are alternate vendors? You know, all those types of solutions, and you still might struggle. But from an underwriting standpoint, that's what they. That's what they're looking. 

S

Speaker 2

30:18

Yeah. And just go into a job, eyes wide open, and if. If you're concerned about something where you don't have, you know, you're not satisfied with your, you know, plan C, then, you know, talk to your attorney and see if you can have an outlet in that, you know, just contractually and, you know, have an outlet in that regard. 

S

Speaker 1

30:37

Yeah, great point. All right, cool. Stacy, I think we might have time for one more. 

S

Speaker 3

30:42

Okay. So, Eric TV said, we understand the most important things to a charity is equity, history, consistency, stability, routine process, procedure, and what are the three most detrimental attributes in the eyes of a surety? 

S

Speaker 1

31:03

If you had to pick three Most detrimental attributes. 

S

Speaker 2

31:06

Ooh, I like that. Yeah. I would say it depends on where the questioner is coming from. But from my seat, if somebody calls me and says they need a bond and we start talking through that process, if in that process I mentioned the character, the first seat that I mentioned in that first conversation, I might ask how their personal credit report looks. That answer is very telling. And the statistics behind somebody who's had a bankruptcy, for instance, it doesn't bode well for round two of starting a business. So I would say, you know, character and more narrowly defined personal credit is a huge item. I would say any. It depends on the contractor. But I would say as. As the underwriting process unfolds, look for systemic items that might cause either project losses or overall operating losses. 

S

Speaker 2

32:12

So it might be as simple as, you know, we've had subcontractor failures on three projects and that, you know, tanked our year. Well, what are we doing about that process? Are we increasing your pre qualification? You know, it's always, it's the whole name of the game is identify systemic risks and understand why you aren't profitable if you aren't. So I wouldn't necessarily narrow it down to three specific items, but the bottom line is anything that prohibits you from being profitable is probably, you know, name those as 1, 2, and 3. And that depends on the scope of work and the trade. 

S

Speaker 1

32:46

I like that. I like the overriding first bullet of like, do you pay your bills? 

S

Speaker 2

32:51

Yes, exactly. You do what you say you're going to do. Good start. 

S

Speaker 1

32:54

If you don't pay your bills as an individual, that might be a problem as a business and the systemic problems. And to me, that's really maybe how I would put a bow on the conversation or wrap up the conversation that we've talked through today is that you've got to identify those things in your business that are creating negative business outcomes, period. That's what you mean by systemic issues, right? 

S

Speaker 2

33:28

Exactly. Yep, yep. 

S

Speaker 1

33:29

And having identified those, be taking proactive steps to address those issues. And then you didn't say this, but I will do, do everyone a favor and don't just throw a body at it. Okay, so, so one of the biggest mistakes I see people make is, we're getting this problem. I need a VP of ops. We're getting this problem. I need a cfo. We're getting this problem and it's it. That may be true, but. But you also have to take personal responsibility for that. As a business owner, as an executive team, personal responsibility for how that thing is happening rather than just bringing somebody else in to deal with a broken situation. Because I cannot tell you how many people I see who are hired and who fail. Because the problem wasn't that they didn't have somebody in the role. 

S

Speaker 1

34:22

The problem was that there are six other things that are contributing in that business to why that consistently happens. And that person hasn't been given control over changing those things. 

S

Speaker 2

34:31

Right, Right. 

S

Speaker 1

34:34

Anyway, we're up on time and we really like to finish on time. So, Josh, I really, again, Stacy and I appreciate you taking the time to join us today and to share your knowledge. I can honestly say that every time I speak with Josh, I get smarter. And I hope that you guys did today, too. I feel like, you know, I hope you feel like you learned something. So just a couple of quick things to wrap up. Number one, make sure that you. If you didn't catch this whole thing and you want to make sure that you get access to it. We are posting these on YouTube. Stacy and I are sending out a weekly email that has contact or. I'm sorry, that has the registration for the upcoming session and that has the link from the previous session. 

S

Speaker 1

35:21

We're getting better at that part, so. So hang in there with us. But if you want to get an email distribution, shoot us a private chat and we'll get you added to our email distribution list. That's number one. We do this every Tuesday, though. In December, we're gonna take a little bit of time off. We do this every Tuesday and next week we will be running this on the 30th. And if I'm not mistaken, Stacy, is that you and I on the 30th. 

S

Speaker 3

35:52

We need a guest to sub in for questions. 

S

Speaker 1

35:56

Yeah. Stacy and I are going to be talking about marketing best practices for contractors, which I'm psyched about, and Stacy is a real pro on. So I look forward to having that discussion. And so, yeah, 8am Eastern next Thursday, next Tuesday, if you can't join, you can always catch the recording on LinkedIn or on YouTube. And if you want to make sure that you don't have to rely on LinkedIn to send you messages, send us your email address and we'll take care of that for you. Josh, any final word for the audience before we sign off? Anything you want to say? 

S

Speaker 2

36:31

Thank you both for having me. Thanks for listening and happy Thanksgiving. Be safe. 

S

Speaker 1

36:35

Thanks. You do the same. Stacey, anything you want to say to wrap us up? 

S

Speaker 3

36:39

If we didn't get to your questions, feel free to reach out to Josh, and I'm sure he could help you with anything. And happy Thanksgiving, everybody. 

S

Speaker 1

36:49

Thanks so much. Yeah. Happy Thanksgiving. See you, team. 

S

Speaker 3

36:52

See ya. 

S

Speaker 1

36:52

Bye.